Please Help with Shamrock Pattern

[SHL72]

10492

http://www.internationaloldlacers.org/MarthaEssPOM/marthaessPOM.html (http://www.internationaloldlacers.org/MarthaEssPOM/marthaessPOM.html)

Ok this is the pattern that started my new obsession. However the pattern is written for shuttle tatters with 4 shuttles :w00t:
I can not figure out how to shuttle tat at all .:sad:
I want this for my dining table but can not sort out how to do it on needles. :huh:
Anyone have any suggestions?

[carolivy]

Oh what a gorgeous pattern!

[SHL72]

I know thats what got me hooked. It is so beautiful and the colours are perfect.

[soyloquesoy]

Sorry, I don't needle tatt. I believe frakira has done some celtic needle tatting :) Or was it you, Carolivy? in Jon's snowflake design challenge...

[soyloquesoy]

oh, and SLH72, thank you for sharing the pattern - it is truly great! I am adding it to my collection (of stuff I'd love to make someday) :-)

[SHL72]

No problem. Its too pretty not to share but I want one :sad: I am going to figure it out eventually :yes:

[PattyD]

Four shuttles for a shuttle tatter would probably equal 4 needles and balls for a needle tatter for this specific project. You need all that equipment because everything progresses at the same time.

It might help you to conquer it to think about the following and draw a rough sketch as you go along. The outer round is in bold.

To start:

Inner light green makes a ring and a chain.

Outer dark green makes a clover and a chain. The dark green chain is woven under then over the inner light green chain.

Inner dark green makes a ring and a chain.

Outer light green makes a ring joining to the previous outer dark green clover and a chain that is woven over the outer dark green chain and then under and over the inner dark green chain.

Continuing:

Inner light green makes a ring and chain, joining the ring to the previous light green ring THROUGH the previous inner dark green ring from under the dark green ring.

Outer dark green makes a clover joining to the previous outer light green ring. This is followed by a chain that is woven over the previous outer light green chain and then under and over the previous inner light green chain.

Inner dark green makes a ring and a chain, joining the ring to the previous dark green ring THROUGH the previous inner light green ring from under the light green ring.

Outer light green makes a ring joining to the previous outer dark green clover and a chain that is woven over the outer dark green chain and then under and over the inner dark green chain.

For the last repeat:

The last inner rings join to both the previous ring of the same color and the first ring of the same color.

The last outer light green ring joins to the previous outer dark green clover motif and to the first outer dark green clover motif.

Join the last chains to their first ring or clover motif and finish ends.

[SHL72]

Thank you. I think I will not attempt this with the thread I bought specifically for it until I have practised on something the same size but not as valuable (to me anyway).

[PattyD]

Just making a couple of repeats in just about any thread should get the rhythm of the pattern going. Remember the outer clover motifs are not just simple clovers. It looks like a central ring with long picots followed by an outer chain.

[SHL72]

I have read the pattern several times and know that for a very new tatter it is an abitious project but its just perfect for where I want it. Thanks so much.

[Catriona]

when finishing the design would it be best to do the rings as "true rings" as apposed to "SCMR's?

[PattyD]

As a shuttle tatter, I would use SSSR (Single Shuttle Split Ring) because it hides the ends automatically.

[SHL72]

I will just have to experiment to find the best way for me to do it. Thanks again for all the assistance.

[xstchntat]

Actually this would be simpler with the needles becauseL
You can do the entire inner round of one color with the needle and ball
Do the second color of the inner round with the second color and 2 needles paying attention to where to weave the colors through by doing the chain and then holding the 2 needles together to weave the chain through behind(needles can fit where shuttles can't so it doesn't have to be done all at the same time) the rings can be joined while in the making if you pay attention to the joining where the rings overlap.
Next do the one color of the outer round with the first color
Do the final color of the outer round with the final color
Study the picture and draw yourself a diagram so that you understand where to weave the colors and you should be able to do the entire thing with just 2 needles. The main thing will be to understand how the colors are woven together and I think would actually be easier because you will have less threads going at the same time.
Good luck and yes trying with some scrap thread first to practice is a good idea. Can hardly wait for pics of your progress.

[Judy]

when finishing the design would it be best to do the rings as "true rings" as apposed to "SCMR's?
I think you would need to try some. The thing about scmr's is that your future ring remains open until you pop the needle through the loop at the end. So, you could weave this partially closed ring through other rings before closing on them. How would you create two "true" rings that were interlocked? If you slipped one ring over your needle, it wouldn't truly be "inside" because that thread that makes your stitches and also goes through the eye wouldn't be affected. I suppose you could unthread the needle and then put the ring over, then re-thread.

[SHL72]

Ok last night I attempted this and here is what I got for the first part of the motif not bad but a little confusing with all the attached threads.
10518

[SHL72]

Ok having attempted this last night and then reviewing PattyD's post I realized that this can be done in steps and stages. Once I get it all sorted out and on paper I will let you all know. But I don't think it needs to be as complicated as the instructions make it seem. I have been drawing pics and making notes on my printed pattern (even tho I am at work and should be doing stuff :innocent:) if only I had brought my needles with me :sad: Maybe I will go get them at lunch time teehee.